Joseph: [00:05] All right, we’re in. Jade, pleasure to have you here today. I’ve known of you for some time was introduced to you. Maybe it’s about eight months ago now through Chase Chewning and through following your work and just getting to know who you are more, it’s an honor to have you here. The work that you do through your all of your brands, but specifically the next level human really motivates me and so I wanted to spend a lot of time today talking about personal development, your story, your growth, your unbecoming and your becoming that something that I kind of felt as a message in a lot of studying of you. So thank you for joining me here today, brother.

Jade: [00:50] Man, it’s great to see you bro and of course, feeling’s mutual been loving, knowing you and your company and doing work with you. It’s been great.
Joseph: [00:59] thank you. Thank you. So I wanted to start just with the creation of next level human and when I started to think about next level human, I had the question of like or the idea concept of like, levels of consciousness, levels of our existence as humans and I really just wanted to dive right into the development of this project and what sparked it personally, externally, internally, and really just start to understand what next level human is, and where it came from.

Jade: [01:38] you know, I think every human probably everyone listening to this, and I know a little bit about your story to Joseph, I think you relate to this as well, I think when we typically think about a creation, right, we tend to go, alright, well, I created this thing a couple years ago, and we tend to maybe see that, okay, the idea came, I don’t know, six months prior to that but that if we really go back, and I think this actually speaks to exactly what next level human is, if we go back, if we go back to like, you know, I’m 50 now so if I go back to my 20s and if I go back to my high school days, but even if I go back further than that, I can see the seeds of this already being planted sort of as a little kid. From experiences where I remember, I must have been fourth or fifth grade to a little kid crying at the lunch table and me going and sitting and you know, putting my arm around this person and like talking to them, what’s wrong? What’s going on? Like? How are you? Almost as a coach, now looking back now at the time, I wasn’t aware, but then I fast forward and I go, you know, you have been doing this kind of work on some in some way, shape or form your whole life. I was the guy that people came when they had issues with breakups in high school, or they had difficult times that, you know, with their parents or family life I was the person. That happened in college to I was that person, it happened again, in medical school, I was sort of that person and so on the one hand, I’m following this path of being a personal trainer, and studying biochemistry, and then going into medical school, and then starting a business but there’s this thread that sort of threads through my life of being someone that is helping individuals deal with the pain of life, deal with the uncertainty of life, deal with kind of just being human, right. And what then happened is, as I’m going through my world, and you and I talked a little bit about developing businesses and stuff like that, but as I’m, as I’m doing this, I am a human and I’m struggling with my own stuff and I have one of these lightning strike moments I called them in my life where essentially, I fall in love with another woman while I’m married, I end up having an affair, this whole thing blows up and sends me into a tailspin. It’s basically like, who am I? I hate who I am. I hate what I’ve done, what has actually happened here, this is not the human that I want to be. And then all of a sudden, and this is what’s really beautiful about this, all of a sudden, by simply saying, I’m going to own this, I’m going to be honest about this and I’m going to make something out of this all of a sudden, I saw these flashbacks to back in my life and all this stuff that was preparing me for exactly this. And I decided at that moment, I said, you know, part of purpose is a choice. We oftentimes think about purpose is something you find it’s really something you choose, and it evolves. And so I was healer. And at this moment, I decided, you know, I’ve seen over and over again in personal training and medicine, that it’s the mindset and the struggles around being a human and the pains around being a human and the suffering around being a human that is often the reason people can’t get healthy and fit or is often the reason behind someone’s illness. And so I said listen, you’ve been studying psychology and philosophy and this stuff your whole life. You’ve been interested in this your whole life, you minor in psychology for reason, you have all these coaching certifications for a reason. I am going to now do something with this. And so to me, one of the primary things in life is that when you have a particular pain, this is I think, a quintessential next level human concept. If you are struggling in a particular way, and you are finding suffering and pain in a particular way, the best way to heal that is to find that pain in other people and seek to help them heal from it. And so next level human was really about that I basically, you know, got to this point where I was like I no longer want to make people obsess about diet and exercise and I no longer want to hit people, when they are at their worst in illness, I want to deal with people who are trying to be the best versions of themselves. Like, I definitely know that talking to you and talking to other people, I do think and believe and let’s see what everyone thinks about this but I have this theory that as we’re even as children, we dream about being something powerful, because I think we have a sense that we are. Right, I think we have a sense that we’re here, we have certain signature strengths and certain superpowers that can make the world a better place in only the way that we can and we lose that, you know, through the culture level, you know, pursuit of power and pleasure and popularity, we lose what our purpose might be. And then, for me, at least, my midlife crisis, or what I call my midlife awakening woke me up to that and so the new purpose and the new venture was to essentially say, let me help other people find their purpose in the way that I have, and help them become the best next level versions of themselves the way I am also on that path, and that’s basically why we’re sitting here having this conversation today.

Joseph: [06:51] yeah, I want to speak to I want to speak to that time, we knew you were in your pain, and you were going into your awakening or your unbecoming. I think there’s so much going on in our world today, that can speak to something similar to this and the concept of being wrong, the concept of being out of integrity, and this like, visceral feeling of trying to protect ourselves or cover something up, we can become so good at that and I think a lot of us learn that in our childhood. I know that I think about the concept of small little white lies as a child like doing something wrong, and being able to cover it up really well and learning that I could actually do that and that’s something that through the course of my life, I had to unlearn and I’ve been through a lot of therapy the last several years to work on that. But I want to ask you, when you were in the pain going through your affair, and I heard you speak to something had to happen to you, for you to finally wake up, oh, wow, I’m no longer in control, I’m no longer able to navigate this situation, like I used to, this is requiring a new version of me. So I want to understand a little bit of that unbecoming a little bit more, and maybe signs or trying to like, grip on like white knuckling the life that you had and who you were, and then really stepping into that next version of yourself and what that like, kind of pull felt like for you.

Jade: [08:33] yeah, you know, um, you know, that that you and I were talking just before we popped on, you know, that that idea of a book, right, that you’ve seen, or you’ve read and didn’t speak to you, or it’s the perfect book at the right time. I think pain is a lot like that. Pain is one of these things that it’s like a book in that if you don’t experience it, you’ll never get the magic that it has to offer. And so in a sense here is ultimately what happened to me and that that statement about pain, you know, sort of being a path to purpose will make I think makes sense to people but here’s ultimately what happened. So to me like you when I was growing up, and you’ll see this thread and I’ll get to your question here in a minute. But I just want to give a little bit of background is when I was growing up, I had a great family upbringing, amazing mother, amazing father, very loving family, but my mother was dealing with a lot of trauma from her childhood. She grew up in a very volatile house, she was abused as a child and she just was having a very difficult time. So I remember as a kid, her being very volatile one minute, she’s incredibly loving, next minute she saw I find her sobbing in her room, the next minute, she’s yelling and screaming the next minute, she was incredibly loving, but this volatility made me and seeing her family’s relationship to honesty made me sort of set me up to you to be a people pleaser, to manage other people’s emotions, to not necessarily tell the truth and I learned that lying and of course, I wasn’t aware of this until this all hit the fan but that lying was my way of keeping everything nice and sort of steady. So now fast forward, I’m in my marriage, and I’m living this dual life and I have a lot of practice with this. I didn’t realize I did. But I have a lot of practice with showing a face to people that exactly who they want to see meanwhile, not necessarily, you know, looking after myself and getting my own needs met. So in my marriage, you know, one of the things that I was doing was trying to be the lover and the husband and the mentor and all these things, not asking for what I needed much at all. So my wife certainly was clueless about that, because I was just trying to, quote, hold it all together and then I meet a woman who is showing me some of these motherly sort of loving tendencies that my mother couldn’t show me because the shit she was going through when she was a kid and here’s where I ended up hitting the fan where it pulled me apart. Doing it to my wife, I was completely unaware. This is so embarrassing. And this is the part that just gets me like, choked up, right, the idea that I’m doing something that’s pretty horrible in the way that I view life now, not then, then I was just like, no harm, no foul, no big deal. Now I’m horrified. And I mean, even more horrified by the fact that the only reason I figured it out was that the woman that I was, I had fallen in love with who I was having an affair with, did the exact same thing to me. In other words, she betrayed me. Now she was also married so she betrayed me with another person, right. I was the one that discovered this and the pain of that woke me up to the pain of what I was doing to my wife. So now I’m in this what I would call a betrayal sandwich and reeling in several ways, reeling, because I know I’m going to lose my wife, potentially lose my wife, who I love. I know I am going to lose this other woman who I love and I’m struggling with that, and I am torn to pieces is what it feels like on the inside and waking up here’s the major thing that tore me to pieces. The old Jade prior to this would have been upset about being hurt. Why is this happening to me this and that? The new Jade cannot believe that he’s waking up and looking at himself in the mirror and seeing a liar, a cheater, and someone who could do what is so painful to him to someone else that he loves so much. And once I came to that realization, all of a sudden all just like we talked about before, like my superpowers were, were shown to me when I was a kid, my dysfunctions, I also had those same patterns. So I had superpower patterns when I was young and I had dysfunctional patterns when I was young and both this is what’s beautiful about this, both were serving my purpose if I paid attention. So in that moment, I essentially was just like, okay, that is it, I am not going to be this human. I’m probably not going to end up with either one of these women and I’m not, by the way, with either one of them today but I am going to be somebody that I can be proud of. I will not be this human anymore. And that actually sent me on a trajectory. I’d already by this time had some good success in my chosen career in the world of metabolism and weight loss. But this is what allowed me to essentially say, Oh, I didn’t realize it previously but I’m actually meant to be teaching this stuff as well. But I had to go through that sort of healing sort of process. So this was like me getting my PhD in psychology and philosophy, because I’ve been reading all that stuff. This is what’s crazy Joseph; I’ve been reading all that stuff since the time I went through my first breakup. I was this guy was self help junkie. I had all these coaching certifications. I had been a couple’s counselor in medicine, in medical school, I took extra shifts as a couple’s counselor. I had all the skills, right, I knew it all like I couldn’t speak the language. I wasn’t living it. And this event forced me to live it and so very clearly what I saw. And it’s now I use this as sort of a phrase, pain as a path to purpose. Suffering is a source to deep seated lessons and meaning. And now it has become the best thing that ever happened to me. And I know that we’ve all heard this before. Isn’t it interesting that we humans, sometimes in hindsight, the things that we are most grateful for are the biggest tragedies in our lives; the illness, the loss of a loved one, the big failures and big mistakes that let us see things that we never would have seen otherwise. And so this left me in that place where I was like, how amazing that I am more generous, more happy, more kind more honest, than I ever could have been as a result of going through this. And now to me, the job of a next level human is to essentially say, I will now pass this on and make the world better in only the way I can and so that basically is the philosophy of a next level human. You might say, well, Jade, what is the next level human? And next level human is simply a person who has a humble recognition that they are a unique spiritual fingerprint on the planet and that they have, by being here, there’s no one that’s ever been on the planet like them up into this moment, and there never will be anyone like them again. So Joseph, Jade, everyone listening to this, we there’s no one like us ever will be on the planet, since or after and our job is to rise to our full level of superpower, our next level selves, so that we can evolve the world positively in only the way we can. Once you understand that, you start realizing that I am here for a reason without the need for acknowledgement or reciprocation, and I am going to do my job. That, to me is what the next level human is, and you can’t get there without pain.

Joseph: [15:56] yeah, it’s so powerful man, when I was studying you, the last several weeks, I drew this picture on my notes to speak to you and it’s just a picture of a pendulum and it’s like, on one side is a low and the other side is the high and the pendulum of life and I heard you speak to suffering, the knowing of future suffering and knowing that that’s just how life works and I think that it’s really important to almost recognize that that pendulum can work but I think that when we think about the pendulum when we swing to that suffering, or swing to the pain, and then we swing back to our next high, it’s almost like we’re not tracing that same path, again. Kind of like the saying of like, no man walks to the same river twice, because he’s not the same man. It’s okay, here’s the next lesson, swing to the next level and so I really thought that was pertinent when thinking about, you know the way in which you discussed the lessons and suffering and so I just wanted to reflect that to you because I thought that was really amazing. When you when you speak about waking up, and then recognizing things in yourself, but seeing those things in other people. And initially, I think I’ve heard you discuss, like, seeing a pattern in someone else but before you’ve been able to create the awareness that it actually is a pattern of your own, you kind of like despise that. You see a behavior in another person and you’re like, oh, like, reject, but really, what you’re doing is like, we’re rejecting ourselves and then we go through this, like this waking up and this awareness and then on the other side of it, you know, when you can say, Okay, well, I recognize my patterns, and I forgive myself of the way I used to operate and to forgive myself, I can still in forgiving of myself, I can still operate at this level of, you know, capabilities that I know, I’m that I know, I’m that I know, I have. I think a lot of really high performers, what drives a lot of them is this idea of like, doing things wrong, not forgiving themselves and like, working so hard to cover it up. It’s like the like success complex, or the overachiever complex. So I want to, I want to ask you, now, in the Jade of today, when you see other individuals that are experiencing or displaying patterns that you’ve seen from yourself in the past, how you how you approach that type of a situation? Because it’s very easy for us to read a book, recognize something and then pick out a person in our lives that’s operating in that way and be like, bam, like, you know, be on the attack, and it’s never going to be a successful way of loving other humans of teaching other humans. So I’m curious, you know what that process is like for you? Because it’s, it’s a, it’s a delicate dance, it seems like and you know, you could be a therapist practicing for your entire life and still be learning this dance and so I’m curious to ask you what that process is, like, in people you love or in clients or anybody that comes to you?

Jade: [19:29] yeah, well, I’ll walk you through a framework real quick just because I think where I’m seeing, we’re going with this it’ll be useful for all of us through this discussion. To me, I look at successful people and when I say successful people, I don’t mean people who’ve made a bunch of money and people who I mean people who go through their lives, understand their purpose and feel fulfilled. There’s a sense of being proud of themselves. That’s what I mean by and that could be someone who’s living on the street that could be someone who’s super successful and everyone in between. The acronym is POWERS. They have to go through these six superpowers, and it goes by the acronym POWERS, P-O-W-E-R-S; key is perception. That’s the first skill we must have. So when I told the story about me waking up to being a coward, a liar, a cheat and all this stuff and admitting to it, this was me mastering perception, it was me seeing who I was really in the world. It’s like almost escaping the matrix right? Now, this is the hardest part here. The next part is the O, which is ownership and once you recognize that, you have to then essentially say, Okay, I’m going to own who I was and I’m going to define who and I’m going to own who I want to be. Now, once you reach this state, it opens up this gap that happens. Now who you want to be in who you are, there’s some distance between that and there’s a lot of experience and understanding that has to come, which means wisdom is the next skill you must master. That’s the W of the powers, right? So wisdom means we must learn to be a different person. Once we have that we have Engagement and Resolve. Engagement is about taking the choices and actions to be this new person and resolve is about fears and overcoming the fears and failures that stand in the way of becoming this new person. And then once you become this new person, the final thing that puts it all together is the S, which is sharing. So this is the six powers of becoming a next level human. Now your question is really useful, because your question lies in the ownership and perception category. It says Jade, how do we know how do we recognize this? To me, whenever we see a repeated pattern in our lives, same thing happen over again, are the same kind of person showing up or recurrent emotions, or familiar obstacles. These things we want to go, Oh, look at Joseph over there, he’s toxic, or this person is toxic, or this, this thing is bad for me but in reality, the way I’m looking at this, as I’m looking at people are practice for us. So if I’m the common denominator, and the same emotion is happening again, to me, that’s on me. If the same pattern recurs again, in my relationship, that’s on me, if I hit the same obstacle, again, that is on me and so what happens is, this is how you know, or am I the toxic one? Or are they the toxic one? If this is a pattern, you’ve never seen an emotion, you’ve never felt an obstacle that, you know, is new, perhaps it’s not you, maybe it is them and you might be able to say, okay, they’re the problem here, but if it’s happening again and again to you with different people in different situations in different environments, than it is about you and so that’s the first step that is Extreme Ownership; essentially saying, this is me. And so I had to wake up to that. So that’s the first sort of way that we tell who is the problem? And I do like to look at this people are practice and like you said to me, if someone triggers me, we all know what this is like, right? Have you ever been on social media and you see someone teaching something or saying something and you just go, oh my God in your head, right? Like, oh, who the hell do they think they are? So it’s the who do they think they are effect, right? And we’re terrified to anyone to see us that way. But we also see a lot of people that way. What has happened when you start living this next level human path, you start seeing these patterns and when you see patterns, it’s either because this was you in the past, it is you currently, or someone you know had been hurt by this particular pattern and so to me, I just simply go, this is a reflection of me. So now it’s really interesting. I’m not going to say I never feel that way. But rarely do I ever see someone teaching online now, and go and not go good for you for chasing your dream and creating. I might not necessarily agree with it but I love creators. Now every once in a while I’ll go bass level, and I’ll just be like, who the hell do they think they are but before the old Jade would have done that, nine times out of 10, the new Jade does it three times out of 10 and all three times I catch it and correct myself. And so this is the first part about looking at patterns. If you’re seeing patterns, and you’re reacting emotionally to stuff, you can either make it about the world out there, which teaches you nothing or you can say interesting, why am I reacting to that this way? Where have I felt this before? I’ll tell I’ll give you an example of this. Part of the part of me has become my religion now is honesty. Like, I’m not a religious person, I’m agnostic, but if I have a religion, it is honesty now. And so once I made honesty, my sort of religion what ended up happening is, guess two things two very weird things happened to me. One I started trusting people. I grew up not trusting people and it makes sense because like you done, you know, you’ve done some, you know, psychology and sort of therapy, right? Well, you know that a lot of our childhood patterns come up well my mom loved the hell out of me but she was also volatile as hell so I didn’t trust women, right, because I didn’t know what I was gonna get my six year old Jade unconscious seed story was like, women are not to be trusted, they’re going to show up one way one day, and they’re gonna show up another way. So I didn’t trust my wife. I didn’t trust any woman I dated. But as I became more honest, right, a liar thinks everyone’s a liar. That’s how you spot a liar by the way; someone who trusts nobody is a liar themselves. But as I took on honesty and own honesty, because I saw this honesty pattern throughout my life, and I started owning honesty, guess what happened? I don’t have dishonest people show up in my life anymore. Very rarely do dishonest people show up in my life and by the way, rarely do I react to you know, a dishonest person in that way, because it’s not even really on my radar anymore and I trust people. So if Joseph says something to me, I don’t go full of shit in the back of my head. Instead, I just go, oh, cool and I take you I trust you until you give me a reason not to. And this is simply by spotting the patterns, fixing the patterns and being Extreme Ownership saying, I will be the most honest person that I know and I will be proud of that. And that’s how this happens. And so I think most people, they want to ignore this, they can spot. There’s three types of humans and bear with me here and it just interrupt me if I’m going off on a tangent, but there’s three types of humans in the in the next level humans sort of model one is the base level human who chases nothing but power, right? Because their major need is safety. Right? So something happened when they were young, but they couldn’t get safety. So they chase power, because if you’re all powerful, you feel all safe, right? So the second group of people is the culture level human, and they are chasing popularity, and pleasure, right? They want to be a part of a team, they want sort of status. The next level human is chasing purpose. And this is an important sort of way sort of to look at this because if you are a culture level human, you are living, if you’re a base level human, you’re like a kid, right? The world revolves around you; kids are wonderful, but still, the world revolves around them, they are all about themselves. If you’re a culture level, human, you’re like a teenager and here’s the thing about teenagers everyone knows what a teenager is excellent at finding all of the dysfunctions in other humans and they are completely blind to their own. And so to me, as we walk this path of becoming a next level human, most of us are stuck in the culture level teenage state. So if you’re finding faults with everyone else, but you never take a look at yourself that is a prime directive that you are coming at this from an adolescent mindset and rest assured the way life works is it wants you to realize your next level human self and my way of thinking. So first, it will nudge you tap you on the shoulder, whisper in your ear, then it’s going to smack you across the face and finally it is going to kick you in the stomach harder than you can ever take it and that is your final opportunity. The midlife crisis, this is not my quote by the way, it’s a quote from Dr. Alan Schwartz, the midlife crisis is the final throes, the final chance to escape adolescence and so this is how you know when someone sees all these patterns and blames it on everyone else they’re operating from an adolescent culture level mindset. There’s nothing wrong with that we’re all this way at times. So am I I’m sure you are Joseph, at times, everyone listening is at times. The idea though is are you aware of it and are you committed to being better and actually achieving this sort of mature adult state? Which most people don’t most people go their whole lives, they get into their 80s and they’re still operating at their cultural level self. We know people like us people who go to their grave, mad, angry, hurt, blaming, destructive, right? That’s not that’s not gonna be me. We all know people like that. That’s because they refuse to look at the patterns.

Joseph: [28:59] it couldn’t be more true speaking to or just watching the course of 2020 and COVID and the election and this side and that side, it’s very, very much in that adolescent. We have adult children running the country. It’s like, what is going on right now?
Jade: [29:24] and think about even conspiracy theories in themselves, right the idea that if you are a trusting person, like I don’t assume someone has nefarious intent. I don’t assume that there are all these people out there plotting against us. To me, I go, and the reason I don’t is because I’m not and I know that I have great money, I’m wealthy, I’m the most, I put my wealth to good. Most wealthy people I know do that so I don’t see people’s having nefarious intent. I see Bill Gates as being a very a person who could just sit at home with all his money and do nothing instead he’s out trying to help the world. Now this isn’t a judgment on anyone listening to this and by the way, I could be completely wrong about this maybe Bill Gates is trying to plant chips in us or something. However, ask yourself this; if you are someone who’s constantly thinking the world is out to get you and all this bad stuff is happening, that’s not operating from your max level self. You can’t make good things happen in the world, when you think bad things are always happening in the world.

Joseph: [30:27] yeah, that’s honestly something that I’ve truly loved about getting to know you and watching your content over the last year, you have this deep commitment to curiosity, truth and like, almost like wanting to be wrong, because when you are wrong, it’s like, it’s this there’s a book actually called Being Wrong that I read this last year, I was like, wow, this is a perfect time to read this but it was like, it said something about the bliss or the joy, in actually being wrong, like shifting our perspective to being surprised when we’re wrong and saying, oh, that’s great. I was wrong and now there’s something new for me to learn. And what’s been really cool is watching yourself, when you you’re always diving into studies and looking at data and I think it’s really cool to watch how your perspective always changes when you absorb information. I think it’s so important because it’s been true for operating a business for me. And I switched. In the beginning of 2020, we went from operating a business from emotion to operating a business, a business based on data and actually following the data and understanding one patterns and truth like the data doesn’t lie. And that’s something that I really respect about you because I’ve watched you do that consistently over the course of everything that’s going on. And I think it’s so important because the having, having like, speaking of children, like the childlike curiosity is really important but allowing ourselves to step past the group think and like, pigeon holed or blinder way of living, and allowing ourselves to actually learn new things all the time by saying we’re wrong is so important. I think that that’s something that’s been so true of just this last year like this, I think just people, people don’t want to be wrong and that’s something that I’ve seen you speak to and I just kind of want to hear you dive into that a little bit. You don’t have to speak directly to what’s going on but just the idea that curiosity and like not always holding on to just one way of thinking and living.

Jade: [32:41] yeah, well, if you go back, here’s, here’s to me what it comes down to if we understand base level, culture level, and next level human in my construct of how this works, base level humans want power and they want to win their major drive is to win, they want to beat you, if they beat you, they will feel safe, if they have all the power, they want to be better than you. Right. So they want to win. Culture level want to fit in. So their major thing is they want to have popularity and they want to fit in with a group. Right? That’s their major thing. Next Level humans want to learn and so when you get in a debate with a base level human, they will do everything they can to win even if they have to change the subject or tell lies or whatever it is and you’ve seen people like this. When you get into an into a thing with a culture level human, they’ll take one of two tests either if they’re if they have other team members who believe what they believe they’ll go on the attack. However, if they don’t, they’ll stay completely silent; they’ll try to get along. Culture level humans are interesting that way; they can either be people pleasers, when they don’t have their team with them, but as soon as they have their team with them, right you know, on the internet you see these teams form culture level humans turn into some nasty individuals. Whereas a next level human simply wants to learn so rather than get into a debate or an argument with you, they’re going to set you start asking you questions, why do you believe what you believe? Where did you get that information from? And they are they are fascinated with the idea that we are all wrong. Right? So an example for me with this as with the mask issue. I started out because I had done a little bit of the mask research in the beginning on influenza and I wasn’t very sold on masks and then as more and more data came out I was like very sold on masks and now I’m a little bit back to not being as sold on mask and it what happens is the less we know the more black and white we go right? And the more we know more the more gray we go. Actually psychology research you probably know this Joseph, but maybe some of your listeners know there’s something called the Dunning Kruger effect. I call it the dunce effect. Essentially what it says is you have to know a lot about a subject to realize you don’t know much about that subject. In other words, you have to know a whole lot about a subject before you start realizing holy shit I don’t know anything about this subject. The less you know, the more stubbornly you know it right? The less you know, the more you think, you know, and the more you know, the more you know, you don’t know. And so this is what happens. So a next level, a human mindset, right because we’re not no one’s a next level human, I certainly am not, we’re just all in process but if we’re in that place, we go, Okay, I need I want to learn, right, I want to learn and you’ll find this is the reason why we talk to experts who really understand a subject, it really pisses people who don’t know much about that subject off, because the language is always it depends. Maybe. Perhaps. This is the language you use, when you really understand a subject deeply. Because the more you know, the more it opens up the space of what you don’t know, right? There’s three levels of knowledge, there’s what you know, you know, like, I know, I know how to drive, there’s what you know, you don’t know, I know, I don’t know how to fly a plane. But then 99.999% of inflammation is what you don’t know you don’t know. And so once you start to understand that all this stuff opens up, and you no longer are going to battle about this stuff and you certainly are not going to make stuff up. So this, this goes to the whole conspiracy thing and some of the stuff that we’re talking about. Here’s the thing who knows, right? But that’s the point. Who knows? So can we say for sure that there aren’t these conspiracies going on and stuff? No, we can’t. But to me, I go, it is immoral in my mind, literally. And I’m using that language on purpose. It is immoral in my mind, to spread information that you don’t know for sure is true. Right? So in other words, just simply say, you know what, I don’t know. We need to wait on that. And that’s most things. And so I think as humans, if we can begin to say, alright, I get it, I’m going base level here, I’m wanting to win. I’m chasing power right now. We all do it. Or I just went team, I just I just you know, got with Joseph so we can, you know, create a team and go against this other person. I just went culture level, that’s all fine. Once you’re aware of it, just go, Okay, why am I here on the planet? And what’s going to make me be a better human and make a better difference? It’s going to be to try to learn what I don’t know I don’t know. And so that’s where I come from. And by the way, I fail sometimes. I’m sure there are times and I know that I do it but I like when it happens now because I catch myself and I go Okay, you’re doing that thing, Jade, you’re being base level right here, you could be wrong about this. It just happens much, much less now. And so to me, it’s really about I’ll say one more thing here. I think if we want to solve the issue of what we see these black and white dichotomies in this back and forth, it starts with us, and this is a Gandhi and quote, I love Gandhi philosophy and have studied him. It’s Be the change you want to see in the world, right? We all of us have heard that, how many of us have lived that? So to me, I go, if I want people to stop making stuff up, because to me, the lies have gotten so incredibly ridiculous that they fractured very good humans. Remember, this isn’t my quote, either but it’s an important one. Good humans operating off of lies and bad ideas, do terrible things. We know that from the Nazi regime. And so to me, truth solves everything. How do you get the truth? You get the truth by being willing to learn, you certainly don’t get the truth by claiming you’re right. And isn’t funny how both the right and the left claim they have all the right information. I love it when it’s like do your research and I’m just like, the other side is saying the exact same thing you do realize that we can find anything to prove our points. A real next level human is going to go I believe this. Let me put it to the test. That’s also a scientific mind versus I believe this, let me go find all this information that tells me what I believe is right. You can always find that man, there’s no there’s no shortage of information that will prove you right?

Joseph: [38:56] read our research that we found, because we wanted to find it. I mean, honestly, it happens in the in the world that I live in the supplement world, like you can create a new supplement, and pay to have clinical trials done but within that you are financially supporting the results that you want to see, at some level at some level. And it’s just, it’s just, it’s just a hard fact. And so it’s interesting, because that plays out in every single piece of our lives. And I want to speak to something that you said real quick, because it’s really important to everything that we do at Cured Nutrition, it’s our logo, the three triangles, we have the three triangles, the triangle in mathematics stands for change, it’s the Delta, and change the three triangles it starts with you and we always view that inner triangle as you, the second triangle as your tribe or your community, and then the third triangle, the outer triangle as the world and that’s the only way that we can actually affect change in this world. It all starts right here. It starts with responsibility, integrity and honesty. And there’s no really way forward besides that, if, if, if you want to see something change, and this is this happened, when the Capitol was stormed, actually, I had people actually all of 2020 this is what was happening, it was, what does your company have to say about what’s going on? Every time something happened. And I finally got to the point where I was like, this is frustrating me but all I can really say is that I one, I don’t know, I have an opinion, but my opinion could very well be wrong based on information that I’m taking in and all I can say is, I’m going to take responsibility for myself and if I can take responsibility for myself, and that ripple out into the people that are I’m most connected to, or connected to that’s all I can do through my life. And of course, we want to have impact on a grandiose scale. That’s the only way that it can happen. And something that I’ve heard you speak to within this concept of responsibility and integrity and honesty, is the, your moral code or your honor code and I just want to speak to your creation of that you speak to honesty as your religion. I think that we can complicate things in life and this is actually a very simple practice is creating this value system that we can then edit our life by and then operate our life by. And it truly is simple. But sometimes when you ask somebody a question, you know, what do you value? It can become very difficult to actually answer that. And I think it tends to do with not having enough time or allowing us to be introspective because we actually are a product of everything that we absorb from when we’re a child. So sometimes I value X is do I value that? Or was that something that my parents taught me or society taught me? Can you speak to creating a value system or honor code and really operating your life that way?

Jade: [42:12] I mean, you know, in every in every philosophy, and every religion, there’s first principles, right? And I love the three triangle model because here’s where people go wrong; what they do is they go, well, I’ll take the first principles from my religion, or I’ll borrow the first principles from this person over here, or this philosophy, we each, those are fine, by the way, those are fine, like if you have a religion, and those are your first principles, fine, but they can’t substitute for your individual honor code that you must create for yourself. So we all need these first principles and it’s really interesting, because we actually are giving clues to this all the time, the way I like to walk people through this, and we can do it right now because it’s super simple. Simply think of your top three heroes. Now these could be people living, historical failures, they could be fictional characters. Some of mine are Muhammad Ali, Bruce Lee, Nelson Mandela, Gandhi, Martin Luther King, my father, the Morpheus from the matrix, right? So I just rattle off a bunch there. Then I could go through and say, what about those people so inspires you? They’re all teachers, they all stood for something that was much more powerful for themselves, for a better world, they saw a vision of a better world, they all spoke truth right. They were very truth speakers. In fact, some of them got killed for speaking the truth. They well several of them got killed personally. These were and they were teachers. They were teaching mass individuals. So then I go, well, what does that say about me? It says that, for me, teaching is a big part, a communicator, being a warrior, a fighter, Bruce Lee, Muhammad Ali, why are they there? They’re there for a reason but they also have a lot of things that are very similar to Nelson Mandela, and Gandhi and these types. So all of a sudden, I see truth, communication, standing for something, helping, standing for myself and helping evolve the world. I want the world to be a better place for me having been here in whatever teeny tiny way I can make a difference. So you write down these heroes, and you get to their essence and then you say, if these are my heroes, then these are this is who I want to be. Now that you don’t stop there and then you ask yourself, okay, imagine I’m dead and I just died and people are at my eulogy and I am a spirit in the back of the room and I can listen to what people have to say about me. Not just a year after my death, but 10 years after my death, what would I want them to say? What would be the words? What would be the essence? So that’s the next your heroes your eulogy and then your deathbed, what will you most be proud of? When you are lying in bed taking your last breath because it doesn’t matter who’s there? You’ve got to pass by yourself. You come in alone, you go out alone. What are you going to feel a sense of fulfillment and pride about what do you want to be? Do you want people to feel about you? Do you want to be someone who tore people down and was in ever quest for power and popularity and pleasure? Or do you want to be someone who gave the world something? It’s not legacy in the sense of ego, it’s legacy in the sense of giving the world something that only you could have given without need for any, anybody putting a monument up or anything like that they won’t even know they’re not going to remember me when I go but the things I do can make a difference. I can, I can talk to one person at a Starbucks, say treat them, give them a smile, say a certain thing they go and do that to someone else. For all I know that ripple makes a huge impact in the world. You settle on four or five different things. So for me, I basically was like, who am I at my core, my superpowers? And who is it that I want to be? Well, I was always kind and generous. I was not honest. Right. And so you do all these things. So for me, my big ones, honesty, kindness, generosity, good communication. Here’s the kicker, though, you cannot go into life with this honor code without firm boundaries and this is where everyone makes a mistake because just because you’re a quote, next level, aspiring human, none of us truly will get there but just because we’re on this path does not mean we have to be kind to people or put up with people who are trying to be base level or culture level. We need firm boundaries, we need to know the types of people that we will tolerate and the types of people that we will not. We need to know the types of things that we will do and the types of things we will not. You and I were talking we both run businesses, right so we, we have tough decisions to make one day, someone’s going to come along and say we want to buy Cured from you, and you’re gonna have to go what kind of company is this that wants to buy Cured from me? You know, these are these are this is what I mean by boundaries, right? And so we need though all of those things. And then from there, we walk out into the world and it’s not faking until you make it it’s Be it until you see it, you start to be this thing, right? So I start to as if I’m a method actor, as if I’m acting like Gandhi, I’m pretending I’m playing the Gandhi part, I start trying, I start trying to show up in the world that way. And then my trying turns into partial success. And then my partial success turns into even more success. And by paying attention to the patterns, and the emotions and everything else, I figure out where I’m going wrong, and where I’m going, right, because guess what new pattern is going to come in, I’m going to meet Joseph and I’m going to meet other people who are honest, like me, and who aspire to help the world like me and want to be responsible, like me and take care of the planet and love their fellow neighbors, and aren’t all about beating people. And next thing I know, I’m walking an entirely different path. And here’s one interesting thing I’ll just throw out there and I don’t know why I felt the need to say this. But here’s another thing when you’re going through pain, especially around romance. So many people go through these romantic they, you know, like I’ve talked to so many people in counseling sessions who are married or in romances who still their head and their romantic self is in some other place with some other person and even through breakups we will oftentimes say I’ll never meet another person like that again. And what I would say to you is good; you don’t ever want to meet another person like that, again, because you don’t ever want to be that person. Again, the reason that person came into your life is because you were this way, you’re now this way, you will not vibe with this person anymore. How many of us have run into an ex or something like that, and we want to try to rekindle that old flame and we’re just like, I don’t know what the hell I was thinking. And the reason why is because hopefully, you’d evolved past that and they have to. There’s no longer any synergy there. Just the way life works. So when you construct an honor code, the hidden benefit is other people with similar Honor Code are going to start showing up and then you’re going to be like, I can’t believe I used to believe everyone was out to get me and people were going to plant chips in people’s arms and the whole world was all these nefarious people and people have to get each other. Now all I see is kindness and generosity and honesty around you know why? Because that’s who you are now.

Joseph: [49:06] I love it. Jade, I could talk to you about this for hours seriously, man, like, it’s well, I was scrolling through your website and I and when people come to come to us, and ask us for certain products and recommendations and, and even the name Cured Nutrition like that’s, that’s a powerful name, right? And we’re like toeing the line there but we I chose that very, very specifically because the truth is, and this came to me at one point, if we could just if we could just remember who we are, who we are in our infallible truths and who we are and our just truths as humans and who we really are and just our most simple essence, then I think we would be cured. And I know that that’s a crazy statement, but I really think that the truth is that we make things so difficult, and as we’ve discussed in this entire podcast is that there are lessons in life and things that go wrong and decisions that we make and pain and everything that happens to us all to get to potentially this place that we’ll never actually achieve. But it’s just this continuous re-evolution. And I think what’s so powerful when I look at you, is your intellect and your intelligence and your experience, and your discussion in, you know, being a doctor in your pursuits and then talking about nutrition and exercise and diet and supplements and underneath all of this is just this, like strong, strong foundation. And I think it’s so important for us as humans to realize that all these things are important when we come to when we talk about the health and wellness world and nutrition and what you put into your body but it’s this foundation of who we are as humans. Standing on this firm foundation is going to allow us to then go to that next level. If we’re on stilts, and one of these legs is a little bit rickety and you know, that doesn’t look very good maybe we shouldn’t stand on the right side of that scaffolding. It’s so important to just build this foundation and we tend to overcomplicate it. And I think it’s so important to just remember who we are as humans, remember that we are continuously learning. And we’re continuously editing our lives. And within everything that you just said, there’s this concept of patience, because we’re going to learn the lessons when we need to learn the lessons, we’re gonna find the people, when we are supposed to find the people and this guiding star, this honor system is so important, can be so simple, but can also be so complicated for so many people. So I just wanted to reflect to you that I just have this great respect for what you’re creating and this concept of next level human is something that really inspires me. I’m really looking forward to the book and just the evolution of everything that you’re doing Jade.
Jade: [52:22] yeah, man. I mean, you said it so well and I’ll just I’ll give just one more sort of way of thinking about it those of you familiar with Taoism, and what Joseph was talking about is a very Taoist type of philosophy. So your honor code in Taoism philosophy oftentimes uses water and the ocean as sort of a way to explain Taoism. In the Taoist philosophy, your surfboard, imagine you’re a surfer, your surfboard is your honor code and what Joseph was talking about there is sometimes you have to live your way into the answer but as long as you’re on your surfboard, and you’re prepared, when the wave comes, because there’ll be a lot of ways to just pass you by but there’s be a wave that comes and Taoism essentially says, the wave will essentially come and then you are a co creator, in that. If you don’t have the honor code, but Joseph was talking about what you’re doing is you’re treading water, the wave just swamps you but if you have your honor code, you’re on the surfboard, you are prepared, and you are ready to be a co creator in life and so for me, it’s no, it’s no sort of accident that you and I that I am I push Cured Nutrition and that I am affiliated with you and we have become close because we vibe on this same level. And I think every single one of us listening to this has the power to create something like your business, the business that I’ve created, or to just show up in the world in this very sort of steady solid place that becomes an experience and an example for others. We are an experience as human and we are an example for others as humans. And as long as we take that on, we have to realize that if I’m base level, I promote more base level behavior. If I’m culture level, I promote more culture level behavior. If I’m next level, then I promote more next level behavior. The one of my favorite quotes, and I’ll kind of leave you with this and we can wrap up but to me is this quote, I forget who said it, but the point of evil is not to hurt you. The point of evil is to make you do more evil. And another quote, the best revenge is not to be that way. So if you are a person who’s worried about all the craziness in the world, all you have to look is at Joseph and that me and other people, and we are by being who we’re being and living into our individual honor codes and creating things that heal the earth and heal humans we are actually the antidote to asshole and the antidote to crazy, and I think that’s what we need.

Joseph: [54:54] we need it so badly, man. I love that. That’s so good. Can you share with the listeners of this podcast where they can learn more about you? I think you have you five books now six books you’re working on two more, you have your own podcast. Where can people find you?
Jade: [55:11] yeah, I’ve got seven books several of them on Amazon. Some of them are available through my internet, but through the my internet publisher, so go on Amazon Jade Teta, you can find some of my self-development books there @jadeteta on Instagram and all the social media www.jadeteta.com is my website and if you’re interested in this kind of stuff that Joseph and I are talking about, and we’re basically in the same sort of arena here my podcast Next Level Human educates on mindset, muscle and metabolism and so you can find me on all those places.

Joseph: [55:48] awesome. Thanks, brother. I just bought next level tribe. So I’m gonna dive into that.

Jade: [55:53] I can’t wait to see what you think man. I by the way, man, I appreciate you so much, man. I can speak for everybody that’s listens to you; thank you for what you’ve created brother. It makes a big difference.

Joseph: [56:05] absolutely, brother and Thank you. That was great spending some time with you. Hopefully we get to do it in person sometime but loved, loved speaking to you. And until next time, thank you [56:18]